Bike won't start on crank, but fires on push start - Ex-500.com - The home of the Kawasaki EX500 / Ninja 500R
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post #1 of 45 (permalink) Old 5-3-2019, 3:13 PM Thread Starter
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Bike won't start on crank, but fires on push start

Hello everyone! I am new here, and I am from Serbia. My problem as follows. Done carb rebuild (with rebuild set) and cleaning by myself last autumn. At the same time, changed oil, filters, spark plugs... It was ok. Stayed through winter in garage with full gas tank with ocassional firing up. This spring I drove 200km when problems started. Fuel consumption was high and it started to fire up with difficulties, had sometimes backfire (burned a little bit air filter), no other problems. Then it won't start at all, but with a little push, engine starts. Took off carbs again, cleaned them again, when I mounted them it took 6-7 tries and it fired up, and worked like a charm. Throtlle was responsive, no smoke, no smell, music for my ears. Everything was ok, it was idle for about 20 min, I turned it off, and after 10 seconds it won't start again, no matter how I cranked it, only one backfire. Lefthand carb was kind of wet. So it won't start by cranking, but when I push it a
couple of meters it starts, and works fine. Please, help me solve a problem.
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post #2 of 45 (permalink) Old 5-3-2019, 5:01 PM
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If a carb is wet it sounds like there may still be issues like a leaky fuel valve ("needle and seat"), but it also sounds like you may have a weak battery. Check your battery voltage before starting. It should be 12.7V or more. If that's good, check it when you hit the button. It should be 10V or more.

If you didn't add stabilizer to the gas before storing it's most likely contributing to the problem. If that is the case the tank should be completely drained (floatbowls too) and refilled with fresh gas.

I'd also sync the carbs after it's running.

Did you remove the caps over the idle mixture screws and clean the passages, then set the screws to 2.5 turns out? There should also be an o-ring on each that can sometimes break and get lodged.
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post #3 of 45 (permalink) Old 5-4-2019, 5:10 AM Thread Starter
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I Will check the battery, it is almost New, but I think it needs recharge. Idle mixture screws are clean, and 2,5 turns out and they are New too,with o-ring. I have noticed, when I cleaned carbs, idle mixture screws tip was slightly bended.
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post #4 of 45 (permalink) Old 5-4-2019, 9:59 PM
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checked valve clearances according to Kawasaki maintenance schedule?

Followed by setting the pilot screws each side for highest RPM (finding the sweet spot)

Difficult start a classic symptom of tight clearances. In good tune, it should start at the touch of the button, every time.

remember...Clean Carbs Matter

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post #5 of 45 (permalink) Old 5-5-2019, 2:34 AM Thread Starter
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Haven't checked the valve clearances. Is it possible that one carb was a little wet because of the too much cranking. If that is the case, valve clearances could be the only problem.
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post #6 of 45 (permalink) Old 5-11-2019, 10:12 AM Thread Starter
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Charged the battery. Crank with a awfull sound from left side, but won't start. Turned on push start. Work like a charm. When warmed up, gone on a drive. After a mile, started to like it's gona turn off. Doesn't response to a trottle immediatelly, but it has power over 2-3000rpm. Turned it off. Tried again, it started, on third crank, with out that awfull sound, it's a progres, before it didn't start at all. Could it be a valve clearances?
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post #7 of 45 (permalink) Old 5-11-2019, 6:50 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tirke View Post
Charged the battery. Crank with a awfull sound from left side, but won't start. Turned on push start. Work like a charm. When warmed up, gone on a drive. After a mile, started to like it's gona turn off. Doesn't response to a trottle immediatelly, but it has power over 2-3000rpm. Turned it off. Tried again, it started, on third crank, with out that awfull sound, it's a progres, before it didn't start at all. Could it be a valve clearances?
Still sounds like you may have fuel or carb issues of some kind.

If you haven't checked the valves it would be a good idea anyway.
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post #8 of 45 (permalink) Old 5-13-2019, 8:46 AM
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Is it only making the awful sound when you hit the starter button?

A starter rebuild may be in your future.

John Z.

If you can't explain it simply, you don't understand it well enough. -Albert Einstein
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post #9 of 45 (permalink) Old 5-13-2019, 11:33 AM
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starter clutch issue?

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post #10 of 45 (permalink) Old 5-14-2019, 2:31 AM Thread Starter
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Ok, starter clutch issue may be the part of a problem, but I want to resolve the problem after it fires up first, like discrebed in previous post. I really appreciate all the help I am getting here, thanks guys.
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post #11 of 45 (permalink) Old 5-14-2019, 8:51 AM
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Is the sound only when you are hitting the starter?

Bad throttle response would be mixture, carbs or valves. Since valve and mixture do not change themselves while the bike is sitting, I would guess that your carb is not happy with the fuel that was left in it when you put it away the last time.
I would start with a good cleaning.

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post #12 of 45 (permalink) Old 5-15-2019, 4:48 AM Thread Starter
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Yes, that sound is only when I hit the starter, but it was Just the first time. On next crank was no strange sound. I put in 3 litres of fresh fuel and there was maybe 2 litres of old one in tank. Maybe those netted pipes in the tank are dirty. Just cleaned the carbs by myself. It was perfect in idle, sitting, but after a short drive started to drop revs.
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post #13 of 45 (permalink) Old 5-15-2019, 12:07 PM
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1, I would check the starter clutch for the noise it was making, sounds like a wooldruf key or a backed out bolt.
2, Check for and remove the vent in the gas tank lid if present, this can cause a vacuume lock and odd issues.
3, Clean the started clitcch and try again.

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post #14 of 45 (permalink) Old 6-3-2019, 6:52 AM Thread Starter
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Hey guys, here is some update. Tried again yesterday, after couple of weeks, put 3 litres of fresh fuel and crank it, it won't fire. Tried jump start, it fires immediatelly, purrs like a kitten. Gone on a ride, has power, everything fine. Parked it, left it for 4 hours, tried again, fired up on second crank, works fine, gone on another drive,everything fine, turn it of, left him for one hour, tried again, it won't fire, tried couple of times, no fire, didn't want to harrass it much. Had that grinding sound from the starter clutch only on first crank and not again during the day. Only thing left is valve clearances and starter clutch. What is more possible cause? Every help appreciated. Thanks guys.
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post #15 of 45 (permalink) Old 6-3-2019, 8:10 AM
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Although probably not the most likely cause, I would move forward with a valve clearance check. It is something that should be done anyway with a newly acquired bike, because you don't know the service history.

Also, how many miles are on your bike?

2006 Ninja500R Purchased new July 2006; 0 miles. Miles as of January 2019; 102,137. It's a GO bike, not a SHOW bike.
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post #16 of 45 (permalink) Old 6-3-2019, 8:34 AM Thread Starter
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65k kilometers
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post #17 of 45 (permalink) Old 6-3-2019, 9:56 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tirke View Post
put 3 litres of fresh fuel and crank it, it won't fire. Tried jump start, it fires immediatelly, purrs like a kitten. Parked it, left it for 4 hours, tried again, fired up on second crank, works fine, gone on another drive,everything fine, turn it of, left him for one hour, tried again, it won't fire, tried couple of times, no fire, Had that grinding sound from the starter clutch only on first crank and not again during the day.
Does this mean most of the times when it "wont fire", your not getting the grinding noise?
You should load test your battery (you mentioned the one time it started easy was with a jump start)
With 65,000 kilometers on the bike reinforces my suggestion for a valve check.

2006 Ninja500R Purchased new July 2006; 0 miles. Miles as of January 2019; 102,137. It's a GO bike, not a SHOW bike.
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post #18 of 45 (permalink) Old 6-3-2019, 10:02 AM Thread Starter
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Not exactly, haven't got grinding sound but won't fire. I meant push start, my mistake. Problem started not long ago, during a couple of days, it was firing heavier every day.
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post #19 of 45 (permalink) Old 6-3-2019, 10:04 AM Thread Starter
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Battery is ok, but I think it should crank a little faster
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post #20 of 45 (permalink) Old 6-3-2019, 10:14 AM Thread Starter
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Just the first crank was grinding sound, after that it fired without it, I am in big dilema
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post #21 of 45 (permalink) Old 6-3-2019, 12:50 PM
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So it fires right up when you jump it? Sounds like low cranking amps or possibly bad electrical connection somewhere. May not be the cause, but I would inspect all the electrical wiring for corrosion or loose connections. Next time it won’t start, pull the spark plugs and check to see if you have strong consistent spark and fuel getting to the cylinder and float bowls. Its easy enough to check so make sure the air filter is clean as well.
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post #22 of 45 (permalink) Old 6-3-2019, 12:57 PM Thread Starter
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Yes, on push start, it fires right up
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post #23 of 45 (permalink) Old 6-3-2019, 3:55 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tirke View Post
Battery is ok, but I think it should crank a little faster
Are you sure?

Quote:
Originally Posted by jkv357 View Post
Check your battery voltage before starting. It should be 12.7V or more. If that's good, check it when you hit the button. It should be 10V or more.
^+1 , Although I think it should be 10.5v or more.
Did you get a voltage check while cranking?
A battery that is not holding up under load can make the solenoid (on the left side of the bike) make a pretty wicked sound, and not start the bike.
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post #24 of 45 (permalink) Old 6-3-2019, 7:04 PM Thread Starter
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I Will check battery and report back
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post #25 of 45 (permalink) Old 6-6-2019, 10:45 AM Thread Starter
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Battery checked. 12,4V before starting, 10,7 while cranking. That seems ok.
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