[Davenay67]

Finally got some time to spend on the 996 today. Got out to the garage, got the rest of the Guzzi/IAW Diag installed. Read through the tips and tricks for install etc. Installed the driver, and still no dice. Tested the interface unit, again no dice.

Had to stop, read some more and think a bit. So the first thing to know is, I'm using an old, old Sony Vaio lap top that is running Windows XP.

Second thing to know is, the Com port has to be configured. It was not. So, after reading that I may have to change the Com port speed from 9600 down to something like 2400 I did both.

Then I had to identify that Com Port 4 was being used as the default is Com 3. I did all that and finally, some level of success. I got the test to run successfully.

So, I booted up IAW Diag and clicked on connect.....zilch. Nadda. So just on a whim I started the bike. Suddenly the parameters all began to display and I got really happy. For about 3 seconds.

At which time I realized the display was all over the place. It showed the idle speed bouncing around from 700 rpm to 14000 rpm and every where in between. All the other parameters were displaying the same way.

I shut it down, changed the load file from the -24 back to the -14 and tried again. Same result. I suspect that the Com Port speed might be too low so I reset it to 4800. About that time the battery on the 996 decided it had enough and packed it in.

I put it on the Shorai charger and closed up for the day. At least I know I can read what is going on now. I got one further error that I noted and that was that the ecu reader didn't work.

The error showed IAW Reader not installed. So now, I gotta figure out where to find that freeware and install it too. Hopefully the switch to 4800 mbps fixes the jumpy readings....if not, I'll change it back to 9600 and see what happens then.

More later.

Man, what a huge effort. I feel for you. You're spending hours troubleshooting the means to troubleshoot the real problem.

 

[ducatiman]

Man o man, what a headache. The cure almost seems worse than the disease. Wish I could offer up something, other than to be deliberate and careful with the guzzidiag system. Sorry, but I'll take the simple Honda PGM alternative anytime. I'm a full believer in LITFA, unless going in is fully justified.

 

[ducatiman]

an interesting concept....

if we were to both confirm software versions we've downloaded, confirm connecting components one by one, slowly confirming step by step while linking each our bikes up to our laptops WHILE ON CELLPHONE together.....its possible some difference may become apparent. Of course, no guarantees...but worth a shot.

I'm certainly no expert, but am able to connect successfully. Both bikes using MM components and guzzidiag software to get there...the fact they are different models is impertinent.

The offer is there to compare steps and methods "live" via cellphone, East Coast vs West Coast. I'm open to give it a shot. You?

 

[Jmmymc750]

Hey, off topic...ish...but McMaster Carr has M4 and M5 x16mm 318 stainless button head or flanged head hex screws for about 10 bucks...per hundred. They have metric M5 rivet nuts ( well nuts) and they sell for about 6 bucks for a 10 pack. I am slowly changing out all the little crappy bolts on the Ninja (not really crappy, but not 318 stainless either) with McMaster Carr products. I am going to have to start selling my extras!

 

[bpe]

^ Look forward to seeing them in the classifieds.

 

[Apriliarider]

I thought it was time I closed the loop on this one. I finally figured out my problems with the funky hesitation, stumble thing at 5K rpm. The thing is, it isn't highly logical on the troubleshooting tree nor something I'd have ever even considered as the source for that.

What I discovered was actually 2 problems that while related in effect, were actually unrelated in functions. Confused? I was too.

I started with the computer because that's where logic said the problem lay. Either in the ECU itself or something in the sensor array that feeds data to it. So, after getting no where with the diagnostic software I started in with my multi meter.

I checked the TPS for proper voltage and that checked out fine. Then I started doing the same for the injectors when I happened across some misrouted wiring. Hmmmmm. The plug lead for the horizontal cylinder was wrapped up in a bundle of wires leading, guess where? To the injectors. Hmmmm. That aint right.

The high voltage pulse to the spark plug can jump to a ground if it's too near. With the ECU signal wire to the injectors also up against that same frame tube, in close physical contact with the plug lead......you can see where that could impact the injection signal.

Then as I was doing research to confirm that might be the issue, I stumbled upon an thread on a Ducati forum where a member was having a similar issue to mine, that turned out to be caused by a fault in the regulator rectifier.

So, I decided to go ahead and install the MOSFET unit I had sitting in its box since its arrival from an eBay purchase. While doing that, I made a couple of other discoveries.

1st, a PO had an issue with the original RR and it melted the connector and part of the battery box.

2nd, in attempting to correct that, both the starter relay and main fuse holder were re-positioned on right side frame rather than the location in front of the batter box.

While moving those back where they belonged, I discovered that the plug to the starter relay was really loose. That, and the positive cable from the battery to the starter relay was super stiff and not at all flexible.

So, @Davenay67 this will help with your starting....the two pins in the connector for the relay fit into corresponding tubes on the harness side. Mine were sloppy like joe and barely making contact.

Using a scribe I "adjusted" the tubes to make better contact with the pins and dripped a bit of corrosion killer on them. Now when I hit the start button, it cranks right over without that typical hesitation.

That sorted out, I made a new positive cable that was much more supple to bend around and connect to the starter relay in it's correct location.

All those wiring issues sorted, I replaced the old shunt type RR with the MOSFET and crimped on the new terminals to the harness side and installed the connectors.

Took a 10 mile test ride and no more burble, hesitation or any of that cruising at part throttle 5K rpm on the freeway. I've ridden once to work when we had a nice day and again, no sign of the injection glitch in any of the places where I'd experienced it before at the same engine rpm.

So, it would seem then that portion of the issues I was having is fixed. It still runs rich on start up but that appears to be related to the engine temp as once it reaches the prescribed engine temp, it leans out and runs normally.

New tires on the way, Michelin Power GPs......$324 a pair at Motosport, but with a $50 rebate from Michelin. At $275 after rebate, that's pretty cheap for a set of 50/50 track day/street tires of this sort of quality.

I figure I got about another 1500 miles and/or 2 years to go before I have to replace the belts so sorted for now.....the end.....sean

 

[ducatiman]

The plug lead for the horizontal cylinder was wrapped up in a bundle of wires leading, guess where? To the injectors. Hmmmm. That aint right.

1st, a PO had an issue with the original RR and it melted the connector and part of the battery box.
2nd, in attempting to correct that, both the starter relay and main fuse holder were re-positioned on right side frame rather than the location in front of the batter box.
While moving those back where they belonged, I discovered that the plug to the starter relay was really loose.

Tsk tsk....I'm a bit surprised how long it took to "discover" these existing issues. How long you owned this 996 now?

Great that you finally got it nailed. Were you ever able to get the ECU to actually connect with your laptop?

 

[Davenay67]

I don't have any starting issues anymore, I fixed them 18 months ago.

Original R/R was toast, battery was dead, and the OEM Ducati charging circuit wires aren't fit to wire a lightbulb. So, I did the MOSFET R/R conversion, installed the biggest, baddest 996 battery (very odd dimensions) that money can buy, and installed my own starter circuit wires made out of 4GA welding cable.

In addition to looking like an engineering work of art, the bike positively leaps to life on the starter button and keeps the battery charged as I ride.

Pulled the 996 out of winter storage last weekend, and it started on the first attempt, idling smoothly and happily as I geared up. In fact, it ran better out of storage than it did when I was riding it over the Summer!

 

[Apriliarider]

Tsk tsk....I'm a bit surprised how long it took to "discover" these existing issues. How long you owned this 996 now?

3 years. Honestly, other than replacing the clutch I’ve not gone into too much on that side of the bike.
I’d noted the melted corner of the battery box and assumed it was from a melted connector. I had planned on the MOSFET replacement a long while back. As it seemed to charge just fine, I put off doing it. You know, if it ain’t broke....

Great that you finally got it nailed. Were you ever able to get the ECU to actually connect with your laptop?

Actually no. Once I started poking around with the DVOM and finding things that I really didn’t expect I simply started rectifying things as I found them.

I would never have thought the RR could cause a spike that messed with the EFI signal, nor even consider that anyone would wrap a spark plug lead in a wire bundle that lead to the throttle body and injectors. Not a great deal of room between the frame and airbox to see a whole lot down there.

it was down to looking at the manual while going over the injector resistance readings I needed to check for when I noted that the battery box arrangement didn’t match the manual.

I have a Shorai installed and haven’t had any start issues beyond the typical lag from when I press the start button to when the starter engages.

Every Ducati of this era I’ve ever heard start or started myself does it. Never thought of it as a problem until I found how loose the plug on the starter solenoid was.

I was more than surprised when I started the 996 up after adjusting those terminals and there was no lag. Starter engaged immediately and the 996 lit off almost instantly.

Aside from a few other minor things to take care of, and new tires it’s ready to ride. Once riding season begins to wane I’ll get back into getting thing set up the way I like....time to ride now...sean

 

[Apriliarider]

Still have not received the tires. Also, they were a bit more than advertised due to application of California sales tax and the environmental fee. As I haven't gotten the tires, I haven't applied for the rebate yet.

All in...as in post rebate, I'll have spent $304 and some change. Still.....not a bad deal, just not as good as it first appeared. Update to follow........sean

 

[Apriliarider]

Tires finally showed up. Front came in last week, rear showed up today. Will see about getting them mounted here in a few days.

On another note, went to a local Italian bike night on Friday. Mainly Ducati’s but a buddy showed up on his MotoGuzzi while another showed up on a ‘Busa.

There were 3 996s there including mine, along with my buddy Scott’s 900SS FE, a spanking new Aprilia RS660, a Monster, a spanking new Scrambler Cafè and a Panigale V4S.

I’ll update later once tires are mounted and installed....sean

 

[Apriliarider]

Tires mounted today! Got them both on quite easily, the new Michelin’s slid on like butter.

Took my time balancing them and going back together. First time I’ve had the rear wheel off and with the SSSA I wanted to make sure I got it right the first time.

After taking all the precautions and lubing what needed lubing I wound up doing quite a bit of corrosion control on random crap back there. Namely the cavities in the wheel are not finished and are bare aluminum.

Lots of white powder forming in there so got all of that cleaned out and sprayed down with corrosion inhibitor. Cleaned the wheels while I was at it.

Took a careful test ride to make sure everything was kosher....and tipping in the first right hander at speed....eye opener!

I dunno if I was just used to the old Q3s or what. Sure felt different.

This is after a ride around the block.

And a few gratuitous pics from our local Italian bike night

 

[Apriliarider]

When I did the MOSFET install, I took the time to install a digital volt meter. As it only came independently I wound up fabricating a carbon/stainless bracket for it to reside on.

Not a great deal of room to make use of behind the fairing and still in view while riding. So I took some thin stainless steel I had sitting in my scrap bin and formed it into a bracket like shape.

Then, I cut some sheet carbon fiber and layered it up a mold I made from some blister pack from a mini-fuse assortment. Once laid up I inserted the stainless bracket between the carbon sheets and added some epoxy.

here it is, mounted to one of the studs holding the speedo in place. That’s the volt meter hanging from its wiring below the bracket.

it’s just an eBay cheapie that happened to meet the required size I wanted.

And installed and wired up. This is what it indicated with the key on. I wired it to the key on powered side of the fuse box so it turns off with the key. Unfortunately, due to voltage loss from all the connectors involved, it registers 12.2 V when the DVOM reading at the battery shows 13.4.

it does not increase in reading until the bike starts and the charge from the alternator starts up. Then I get a reading of 13.7 at idle, which is what it should be.