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KAWASAKI Ninja 250, 2007, 17k
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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Not sure to post here in Troubleshooting or in Engines?
New to bikes...well as a Rider anyhow. New owner of a 2007 ninja 250 with a little over 17k miles. Trying to get it up & running.
Bike has sat for 7 years...pretty basic tasks already preformed on it that needs to be for a bike that has sat that long. Oil change, New battery, New plugs/wires, Cleaned gas tank, New gas, Air filter, Cleaned carbs. Still won't start & is still leaking gas out of carb overflow tube. So I'm here looking for guidance & advice. I've read a lot on here already & have already followed a lot of advice tips given to other for same issue.

Before started first time: gas tank was cleaned/emptied & new gas was put in, oil change, new battery, new plugs/wires.
For initial start, it started after trying for a minute, but started leaking gas, so shut off & started researching.
From initial start Gas did get in the air filter & oil--hence why we did the carb cleaning per the advice given on the forums here...
After carefully cleaning the carbs-to a T (following instructions & instructional videos) & putting everything back together it doesn't want to start again. Started leaking gas again from overflow tube!
Carbs weren't too dirty, but there was issues in there...there was some green corrosion in one of the float bowls on the jets, obvi from the gas not being emptied. Main reason I assumed the overflow was happening in beginning-Both float valve needle springs were stuck in place-no movement from the nipple at all, but was able to get them to come loose with light cleaning & they still had good spring to them. Set floats to 17mm. They had good spring, both, before I closed them up. All the jets came clean. Diaphragms were in good shape. Not sure what to check next.
We have spark & gas is getting to spark plugs...they were both gapped to .07-.08mm.

If you have experience with this issue-i would appreciate & accept any & all advice you may have for me!
 

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hi, answered this in your other post (before I saw this one). sorry. do a wet test first before delving into the carbs again and did you clean and blow out all those very small pathways inside the carb bodies it's very important.
 

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Welcome from the land of evil spirits!

As to the carbs, the float needles (with the rubber tip) are throwaway items. A decent carb kit will have new ones, as well as the gasket and seals needed to close them up. But then, float level must be set, so that those needles shut off the flow of gas before th4 bowl overflows - which I think is happening to your bike.

The market is absolutely flooded with cheap "PRC" kits. I would not touch them. I have ordered kits from Taiwan and found them to be very good and about 25% of the price of K&L kits from Japan. Others will chime in, but ya gotta have new needles. And a Q-tip sprayed with carb cleaner to clean the seat in which the needle rests. If you don't do that, you can have new parts and still have a leak. .

Do you have a good manual? Everyone has their favorite, but I like either (used) Kawasaki OEM service manuals, or Haynes is also very good, easier to find and cheaper. Haynes is written more for the private owner. The eBay item number below is for a seller whose kits are good stuff.

223052737894
 

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KAWASAKI Ninja 250, 2007, 17k
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Discussion Starter · #4 ·
hi, answered this in your other post (before I saw this one). sorry. do a wet test first before delving into the carbs again and did you clean and blow out all those very small pathways inside the carb bodies it's very important.
Okay I'll look into the wet test. The very small pathways? Where the jets sit? If so Yea, everything in the carbs was cleaned with compressed air then carb cleaner. I made sure all the build up was cleaned out of everywhere I could touch & I could see/blow through everything...I'm a bit of a ocd personality when it comes to doing things so I'm usually very thorough.
 

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The one that will get you is the tiny passages between the recessed pilot jet (inside the float bowl) and where the idle mixture actually exits into the cylinder head via the adjustable pilot needle. You need a special or a "ground-to-fit" slot-headed screwdriver to fit down into the recess and loosen the pilot jet. These are really simple carburetors, but they must be clean clean clean. Then your bike will hum. And no post-nasal drip.
 

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KAWASAKI Ninja 250, 2007, 17k
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Discussion Starter · #6 ·
Welcome from the land of evil spirits!

As to the carbs, the float needles (with the rubber tip) are throwaway items. A decent carb kit will have new ones, as well as the gasket and seals needed to close them up. But then, float level must be set, so that those needles shut off the flow of gas before th4 bowl overflows - which I think is happening to your bike.

The market is absolutely flooded with cheap "PRC" kits. I would not touch them. I have ordered kits from Taiwan and found them to be very good and about 25% of the price of K&L kits from Japan. Others will chime in, but ya gotta have new needles. And a Q-tip sprayed with carb cleaner to clean the seat in which the needle rests. If you don't do that, you can have new parts and still have a leak. .

Do you have a good manual? Everyone has their favorite, but I like either (used) Kawasaki OEM service manuals, or Haynes is also very good, easier to find and cheaper. Haynes is written more for the private owner. The eBay item number below is for a seller whose kits are good stuff.

223052737894
Hi there! Thanks for writing.
Yes I learned about the float needles...these looked to be in good shape beside being a little stuck, perfect rubber tip still, so decided to continue & try to use them, but I know they go bad. I have ordered a kit because no one has them locally...was trying to get it atleast running in the meantime-to find & start on any other possible issues. I did not see or learn about the q-tip method yet & did not do that...so thanks for that info.
I did a lot of research about the floats & them Needing to be set just right & spent about 45 minutes learning how to do it & to Get It Right to the 17mm as best as I could-within a minimum 1mm of 17 anyhow.
I do not have a physical manual yet-this was very spur of the moment thing, getting the bike. So it's coming, I'm just impatient & want to get it all done now 😆.
 
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in addition to all the above info....your pilot screws are set how many turns out? Kits are mandatory, though I'd dissuade using jets/needles/pilot screw (tuning components) supplied with them. Basically, you're buying them for the orings. Unfortunate you've already ordered kits as I stock and sell everything needed for 250 rebuild (as well as 500). I've got a bit of experience with both.

1st pic....note to make sure your decel valve diaphragm is both clean and has retained its in/out motion, and is not frozen in place.

2nd a pic of a wet test (note perfect fuel level)

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KAWASAKI Ninja 250, 2007, 17k
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Discussion Starter · #8 ·
The one that will get you is the tiny passages between the recessed pilot jet (inside the float bowl) and where the idle mixture actually exits into the cylinder head via the adjustable pilot needle. You need a special or a "ground-to-fit" slot-headed screwdriver to fit down into the recess and loosen the pilot jet. These are really simple carburetors, but they must be clean clean clean. Then your bike will hum. And no post-nasal drip.
/QUOTE]

I did Remove, soak in carb fluid & clean the outsides & insides (with air compressor, carb cleaner) of all of the metal parts & jet/jet components that would come out--the Main Pilot Jet, Emulsion tube & Pilot Jet (In my tools I had a skinny enough screw driver to get in the tube without touching sides-it was perfect for it!). Could see through all of the jets. I believe I read that the entire float bowl/recessed pilot jet can also be removed, but I did not do this-it did not want to come out & I didn't want to damage anything.
With everything out of the carbs that came out, I thoroughly cleaned all passages/holes, the bottoms, tops & sides of the carburetor-with air then with carb cleaner. I put compressed air through each jet hole to clean out the internal passages. The entire part was very clean when I was done, not one spec of dirt or residue inside of them...I worked on it for probably 3 hours or more total, with float adjustment-taking my time because it was my first time☺. I didn't want anything to go wrong or have to do it again-so very meticulous about it.
I did not stick a q-tip in the float valve though, as someone suggested.

Im guessing it's probably that the parts that were in it are just not good anymore?...but I atleast wanted to try with them.

Is there another passage way besides the pilot jet, main pilot jet & inside float bowl that should be cleaned?
 

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Discussion Starter · #9 ·
in addition to all the above info....your pilot screws are set how many turns out? Kits are mandatory, though I'd dissuade using jets/needles/pilot screw (tuning components) supplied with them. Basically, you're buying them for the orings. Unfortunate you've already ordered kits as I stock and sell everything needed for 250 rebuild (as well as 500). I've got a bit of experience with both.

1st pic....note to make sure your decel valve diaphragm is both clean and has retained its in/out motion, and is not frozen in place.

2nd a pic of a wet test (note perfect fuel level)

View attachment 54692

View attachment 54693
Hi.
I did not mess with the the pilot/idle screws because they are capped & I didn't know how to get them off or if I was supposed to!!?

I didn't pay much for the kit, I may be interested in getting one from ya. Can you send me a message to discuss?
The diaphragm & spring were in very good condition, gently wiped it up...the entire carburator was actually really clean inside, only small amount of residue, one had green corrosion up on the top of main jet & on top of float bowl brass, that was the worst of it.
 

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KAWASAKI Ninja 250, 2007, 17k
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Discussion Starter · #10 ·
The one that will get you is the tiny passages between the recessed pilot jet (inside the float bowl) and where the idle mixture actually exits into the cylinder head via the adjustable pilot needle. You need a special or a "ground-to-fit" slot-headed screwdriver to fit down into the recess and loosen the pilot jet. These are really simple carburetors, but they must be clean clean clean. Then your bike will hum. And no post-nasal drip.
I did Remove, soak in carb fluid & clean the outsides & insides (with air compressor, carb cleaner) of all of the metal parts & jet/jet components that would come out--the Main Pilot Jet, Emulsion tube & Pilot Jet (In my tools I had a skinny enough screw driver to get in the tube without touching sides-it was perfect for it!). Could see through all of the jets. I believe I read that the entire float bowl/recessed pilot jet can also be removed, but I did not do this-it did not want to come out & I didn't want to damage anything.
With everything out of the carbs that came out, I thoroughly cleaned all passages/holes, the bottoms, tops & sides of the carburetor-with air then with carb cleaner. I put compressed air through each jet hole to clean out the internal passages. The entire part was very clean when I was done, not one spec of dirt or residue inside of them...I worked on it for probably 3 hours or more total, with float adjustment-taking my time because it was my first time☺. I didn't want anything to go wrong or have to do it again-so very meticulous about it.
I did not stick a q-tip in the float valve though, as someone suggested.

Im guessing it's probably that the parts that were in it are just not good anymore?...but I atleast wanted to try with them.

Is there another passage way besides the pilot jet, main pilot jet & inside float bowl that should be cleaned?
 

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Hi there! Thanks for writing.
Yes I learned about the float needles...these looked to be in good shape beside being a little stuck, perfect rubber tip still, so decided to continue & try to use them, but I know they go bad. I have ordered a kit because no one has them locally...was trying to get it atleast running in the meantime-to find & start on any other possible issues. I did not see or learn about the q-tip method yet & did not do that...so thanks for that info.
I did a lot of research about the floats & them Needing to be set just right & spent about 45 minutes learning how to do it & to Get It Right to the 17mm as best as I could-within a minimum 1mm of 17 anyhow.
I do not have a physical manual yet-this was very spur of the moment thing, getting the bike. So it's coming, I'm just impatient & want to get it all done now 😆.
Patience! True love waits.
 
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. I believe I read that the entire float bowl/recessed pilot jet can also be removed, but I did not do this-it did not want to come out & I didn't want to damage anything.
With everything out of the carbs that came out, I thoroughly cleaned all passages/holes, the bottoms, tops & sides of the carburetor-with air then with carb cleaner. I put compressed air through each jet hole to clean out the internal passages. The entire part was very clean when I was done, not one spec of dirt or residue inside of them...I worked on it for probably 3 hours or more total, with float adjustment-taking my time because it was my first time☺. I didn't want anything to go wrong or have to do it again-so very meticulous about it.
I did not stick a q-tip in the float valve though, as someone suggested.

Im guessing it's probably that the parts that were in it are just not good anymore?...but I atleast wanted to try with them.

Is there another passage way besides the pilot jet, main pilot jet & inside float bowl that should be cleaned?
I see a couple of problems here. how can you be sure all the passageways are clear if some parts were left in place.
the pilot screws have a cap this has to be removed. (drill a small hole in the cap and lever it off) this gives access to the adjustment screws. one of the small pathways goes from the carb body to screw. and the screw it's self has a small opening where the tip of the screw sits. after cleaning the screws need setting 2 and a half turns out. but require further tweaking once running on the bike.
second it doesn't matter how accurate you are getting the float heights to exactly 17mm because other factors come into play. the only true way to see the actual fuel levels is by wet testing. the 17mm is a guide only to get you in the right ball park.
also while the carbs are very similar on the 250 they are not the same as the 500 some differences exist. @ducatiman (AKA custom carb services) knows these carb set up's off by heart. so follow any advice he has.
 

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@ducatiman
Is 17mm the correct float height spec for the 250's?
 

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Yes, 17 is correct as written. Though you know I always confirm/tweak via testing. Older carbs can give strange, differing levels L and R....I equalize them. This can be evident after using new float valves and polishing seats.

your pilot screws are set how many turns out?
Why would i have asked this? OP has missed a major portion of the pilot circuit, additionally a critical pathway to cleaning the transition ports. And the all important tiny oring must be replaced.

You must remove the EPA anti tamper caps and pilot screw, spring, washer and oring to access and precisely clean the above mentioned areas, resetting at 2 1/2 turn starting point when done.
 

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I almost forgot.....check your fuel line for an errant rail filter. 250 rail filters (loose fitting) have a habit of pulling out and "going missing" staying within the fuel line. Could cause flow problems, as I've found them crumpled up. Replace with the tighter fitting 500 version, it stays put when fuel line is removed.

Also double check for presence of both needle jets , which frequently, silently drop out and go "missing".
 

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Discussion Starter · #16 ·
I see a couple of problems here. how can you be sure all the passageways are clear if some parts were left in place.
the pilot screws have a cap this has to be removed. (drill a small hole in the cap and lever it off) this gives access to the adjustment screws. one of the small pathways goes from the carb body to screw. and the screw it's self has a small opening where the tip of the screw sits. after cleaning the screws need setting 2 and a half turns out. but require further tweaking once running on the bike.
second it doesn't matter how accurate you are getting the float heights to exactly 17mm because other factors come into play. the only true way to see the actual fuel levels is by wet testing. the 17mm is a guide only to get you in the right ball park.
also while the carbs are very similar on the 250 they are not the same as the 500 some differences exist. @ducatiman (AKA custom carb services) knows these carb set up's off by heart. so follow any advice he has.
All the passages I could open were cleaned...but ur right I didn't get everything open. The float valve & idle mix screws I did not remove because didn't know how to get them open or if I was supposed to, but thanks to your guys advice I know that needs to be done.
Will be performing wet test after get parts & replace them, before it goes back in bike
Yea I have read & followed a ton of info given by ducatiman-he seems to know his ish & am currently speaking with him in a Convo.
 

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Discussion Starter · #17 ·
I almost forgot.....check your fuel line for an errant rail filter. 250 rail filters (loose fitting) have a habit of pulling out and "going missing" staying within the fuel line. Could cause flow problems, as I've found them crumpled up. Replace with the tighter fitting 500 version, it stays put when fuel line is removed.

Also double check for presence of both needle jets , which frequently, silently drop out and go "missing".
Okay I will check on these things. Thanks for all the advice!!!
 

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difference between jet needle in pic 1, (though not EX) ... and EX needle jet in pic 2 (being held with needle nose pliers)

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Oh yeah, that bit. My EX ran like crap until I figured out that one of them fell out during the first rebuild many moons ago.
 
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Discussion Starter · #20 ·
Oh yeah, that bit. My EX ran like crap until I figured out that one of them fell out during the first rebuild many moons ago.
Damn...Yea thankfully I was being careful & noticed when one came out, so grabbed the other out. After cleaned they both went right back in...otherwise they might have been lost too
 
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