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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Hello again,

I am once again stumped, and find myself here looking for help.

Long story short, I bought a 92' ex500 with 40,000 kms that has been sitting for long, and tried to rebuild it.

after some clean up, I was able to get it start, but it was short lived. Between my starting attempts, I had an issue, where the starter would sometimes seem to not engage, and I would only hear a clicking noise from the relay. After multiple attempts however, it would crank, but the starter would sound weaker the more I tried to crank. Last week, I tried to start it after having removed the carbs, but I only got clicking noises, and no cranking whatsoever.

I figured the starter/solenoid are malfunctioning. I replaced the solenoid, and tested the starter outside of the bike. All good, but still same issue unfortunately, (I also replaced the battery and connections from battery to solenoid and starter. also cleaned all contact points)

After that, I figured the culprit could either be a seized or hydro-locked engine, but since the engine started last week, I ruled out seizing, and assumed a hydrolock due to a failed petcock. I removed the sparkplugs, and tried to push the bike while it is in gear to push the fuel out, but nothing happened, the tire would just lock when I released the clutch. I also pushed a piece of paper through the spark holes to see if there was fuel, but the combustion chamber was dry... After draining the oil I did smell fuel, and there was also way over 4.3 quarts in there...

At this point there is no other diagnosis other than a seized engine/bent rod. I just cannot understand how it came to be this way since the engine ran normally last week, before I removed the carbs for fine tuning. I did not hear any metal or clanking noises when I was starting. I poured in some WD40 in the combustion chamber now, and added a little bit of oil, hoping it would release overnight if it was seized for some reason.

I tried to spin from the generator bolt. I was scared to spin it anticlockwise so I did not. When I spin it clockwise however, the bolt would just come lose (Lefty tighty). does anyone have an Idea how I can spin it by hand,.without having to remove the alternator (do not have the tool for it)

I really doubt that the starter is strong enough to bend a rod while trying to start when hydrolocked. I also cannot understand how an engine could just seize when it was running the week before. does anyone have any other Idea what this might be, or what might have caused it?

I really appreciate your help. I just got my Motorcycle License recently and I have been yearning to ride, but this bike would not let me :(

Regards,
Sam
 

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Discussion Starter · #2 ·
After reading around in the forums, I came across an Issue that seemed familiar.


Could I have something in my crankcase/flywheel assembly blocking my motor from cranking?
 

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as was written in your linked post...starter clutch bolts backing out of the backside of the flywheel, its actually fairly common, easily correctible.

Evidently, I've responded to incorrect thread, sorry.
 

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Discussion Starter · #4 ·
But from what I understood this would cause the starter to engage, but the engine not cranking at all.

The issue with me is that when the starter does engage after many attempts, the engine cranks with it. Otherwise the starter would not engage at all, just clicking noises from the solenoid.

recently, the starter havent been engaging at all.

Note: I noticed when the engine is warm, it seems to start right up. Am I using the wrong oil? Im using 10w40, and we have reached freezing weather recently, and the bike sits outside covered.
 

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Discussion Starter · #5 ·
as was written in your linked post...starter clutch bolts backing out of the backside of the flywheel, its actually fairly common, easily correctible.

Evidently, I've responded to incorrect thread, sorry.
Its fine, would still appreciate some help though... :)

Could valve clearances be an issue in not letting the engine crank?
 

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Could valve clearances be an issue in not letting the engine crank?
It could be an issue in not letting the engine start.
A valve adjustment should be one of your first tasks.
 

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Valve clearances will not cause more compression (engine harder to turn), but only less. If the valves are too tight (particularly the exhaust), they will bleed compression off and make the bike resistant to start. But, it will still turn over just as fast with the starter.

How is the battery? It sounds like the battery may be producing enough voltage, but the amperage is too low. Consider: 8 "AA" flashlight batteries produce 12 volts - but are they strong enough to spin that engine? Certaoinly not. Amperage is crucial. Low amperage can be from low temperature, the state of the battery charge, or just a failing or too small battery.
 
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Discussion Starter · #8 ·
Valve clearances will not cause more compression, but only less. How is the battery? It sounds like the battery may be producing enough voltage, but the amperage is too low. Compare: 8 "AA" flashlight batteries produce 12 volts - but are they strong enough to spin that engine? Certaoinly not. Amperage is crucial. Low amperage can be from low temperature, the state of the charge, or just a failing or too small battery.
I tried two new batteries, and one old battery that was tested for amps and passed. Still nothing. I dont think thats an issue. I am pretty sure the engine is seized. The starter ran perfectly outside the motor, and I replaced the solenoid.
 

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Discussion Starter · #9 ·
Valve clearances will not cause more compression, but only less. How is the battery? It sounds like the battery may be producing enough voltage, but the amperage is too low. Compare: 8 "AA" flashlight batteries produce 12 volts - but are they strong enough to spin that engine? Certaoinly not. Amperage is crucial. Low amperage can be from low temperature, the state of the charge, or just a failing or too small battery.
The Issue isnt with compression, but the engine physically not being able to move any further. Upon trying to jumpstart the bike, the rear tire just locks up when clutch is engaged. this also happens when sparks are disconnected
 

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Discussion Starter · #12 ·
The good news is, we know your engine is not seized.
I tried to spin the crank today by hand, no luck. But I was not sure what I was doing so ill explain what happened.

I tried to move the bolt clockwise but it just ends up loosing it, without spinning the crankshaft.
In the other direction it just tightens what I have loosened earlier, then at one point it reaches a certain tightness and continues to spin but does not get tighter/harder to spin. I assume this is due to the crankshaft spinning in the opposite direction. How can I get the crankshaft to spin clockwise without loosening the flywheel bolt?
 

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After draining the oil I did smell fuel, and there was also way over 4.3 quarts in there...
That sounds like a carb cleaning and rebuild.
 

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Discussion Starter · #14 ·
That sounds like a carb cleaning and rebuild.
I rebuilt the carbs already, and uninstalled them twice to make sure floats are functioning properly. All good. The fuel in the crankcase is due to both: a malfunctioning petcock and me leaving it on "ON" overnight. Pretty sure of it
 

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How can I get the crankshaft to spin clockwise without loosening the flywheel bolt?
Use a strap wrench to hold the flywheel. Tighten the flywheel bolt tight, to 51 ft.lbs. Remove the spark plugs. Then rotate the engine using the flywheel bolt.
 

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The fuel in the crankcase is due to both: a malfunctioning petcock and me leaving it on "ON" overnight. Pretty sure of it
You have to have leaking float valves for fuel to enter the crankcase.
 

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Discussion Starter · #17 ·
Use a strap wrench to hold the flywheel. Tighten the flywheel bolt tight, to 51 ft.lbs. Remove the spark plugs. Then rotate the engine using the flywheel bolt.
Thank you, I appreciate your help. Will try this tomorrow as it is 10 PM in Germany currently.
 

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If it is the original "vacuum" style petcock, it must be leaking, as they normally shut themselves off when the engine stops. If so, parts are available to renew them. If it is a manual petcock, the same could be happening. However, it sounds like the float valves are allowing gas to bypass and flow directly into the engine.

Point: When you replace the carbuetor parts, there might be one spot that has gasoline residue or corrosion on it, and that is the "seat" for the float valve. It is in a recess in the body of the carburetor and can easily be overlooked inn a cleaning. Those are best cleaned with a "Q-tip" soaked in lacquer thinner or other solvent. A bike that sat for years may well have enough residue on the float valve seats that the valve cannot close. Then, fuel leaks past and runs into the cylinders. And then all of the rest happens.
 

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Discussion Starter · #19 ·
If it is the original "vacuum" style petcock, it must be leaking, as they normally shut themselves off when the engine stops. If so, parts are available to renew them. If it is a manual petcock, the same could be happening. However, it sounds like the float valves are allowing gas to bypass and flow directly into the engine.

Point: When you replace the carbuetor parts, there might be one spot that has gasoline residue or corrosion on it, and that is the "seat" for the float valve. It is in a recess in the body of the carburetor and can easily be overlooked inn a cleaning. Those are best cleaned with a "Q-tip" soaked in lacquer thinner or other solvent. A bike that sat for years may well have enough residue on the float valve seats that the valve cannot close. Then, fuel leaks past and runs into the cylinders. And then all of the rest happens.
Okay, I will try solving the seized engine issue first then get back to this. Could I send you a picture when I get to it to confirm the issue?
 

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It will take some close-up photography to capture the float needle seat, as it is recessed into the carb body. There are undoubtedly some photos in the carburetor section here.
 
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