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So I did a valve clearance check but I slipped the feeler gauges between the rocker arm and cam shaft. That was my first mistake I think.
this will not cause you any issues in it's self. it just means you never set the valves correctly. only checked the clearance of the tightest valve. not that a bike with 3k should need them doing. it's how I do a quick check on mine. to see if any of the valves are too close. when ever i take the top cover off. (usually it would be a exhaust valve).
no it's not the way to do them but it's not causing your present issues. by all means do them again properly once it's running.
 

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It is a brand new battery and I took it in to get recharged. So now the bolt is loose and I need to unstick the motor and redew my valve clearances correctly or do u think I did it right with the cam and rocker arm and my flywheel was loose cuz sometimea I hear some loud clank noise coming from the flywheel when starting and the bolt should have never gotten loose how do I tighten that bolt if I'm not supposed to go counter clockwise?
 

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this will not cause you any issues in it's self. it just means you never set the valves correctly. only checked the clearance of the tightest valve. not that a bike with 3k should need them doing. it's how I do a quick check on mine. to see if any of the valves are too close. when ever i take the top cover off. (usually it would be a exhaust valve).
no it's not the way to do them but it's not causing your present issues. by all means do them again properly once it's running.
It was running and now its not cranking. And the bike was sitting for many years I bought for 600 that may be the real reason it was so cheap
 

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hi. no no no either you have misunderstood what I wrote or not read it correctly.
NO that is not the correct way to adjust the valves at all. BUT it can be used for quick check to see if any of the valves are tight. nothing more. why I will try to explain.
the engine has 4 valves per cylinder 2 inlet and 2 exhaust. but only has two lobes per cylinder on the camshaft. SO the cam follower is a single piece that operates both valves. adjustment is done by the adjusting nut on the top of each valve, taking a measurement between the valve stem and the underside of the adjusting nut. OK got that.
NOW if you take a reading under the cam lobe. your not checking the clearance of each valve BUT a pair of valves. so can only take the measurement of the valve with the smallest gap. if one valve is running at 10 thou and the other at 7 thou the reading you get under the cam would be 7 thou, because that is the smallest gap out of the pair.
now given that the gaps tend to close up not widen. doing a quick check that way ensures none of the clearances are too tight. it's a quick check nothing more.. if they are tight you have to do a full clearance check. the maintenance period for doing the valves is 7k ish. yours has only done 3k so not critical at this point. so provided not of the vales were tight you should be ok for now.

as for the flywheel your not going to turn the engine the wrong way just tighten a bloody nut. it's a left hand thread so how are you going to tighten it without turning it anti clockwise. all you have to do is shock it tight so it doesn't come loose when you turn it clockwise (as in engine rotation) to check if the engine is free without it undoing again. come on man it's not rocket science. just simple engineering.

a clanking noise when the engine turns is NEW information also. suggest at this pinot you take the case off (if it's not off already) you never said either way. remove the centre bolt and pull off the flywheel to check if any of the bolts holding the starter clutch (onto the back of the fly wheel are LOOSE. and trying to destroy the sprocket of the starter chain that lies behind it. there should not be any clanking when the engine is turned over. EVER.
It was running and now its not cranking. And the bike was sitting for many years I bought for 600 that may be the real reason it was so cheap
this is also new information I suspected this was the case a 7 year old bike with 3k has to have been stood for a few years. and to get a 2 grand bike for 600 it has to have got issues. and yes it probably was the reason it was cheap.
either way you have it now. and have to fix it. so one thing at a time. suggest you get manual for it and have a good read though it. in the meantime take the case off and the flywheel look for damage. post some photos of what you find.
 

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hi. no no no either you have misunderstood what I wrote or not read it correctly.
NO that is not the correct way to adjust the valves at all. BUT it can be used for quick check to see if any of the valves are tight. nothing more. why I will try to explain.
the engine has 4 valves per cylinder 2 inlet and 2 exhaust. but only has two lobes per cylinder on the camshaft. SO the cam follower is a single piece that operates both valves. adjustment is done by the adjusting nut on the top of each valve, taking a measurement between the valve stem and the underside of the adjusting nut. OK got that.
NOW if you take a reading under the cam lobe. your not checking the clearance of each valve BUT a pair of valves. so can only take the measurement of the valve with the smallest gap. if one valve is running at 10 thou and the other at 7 thou the reading you get under the cam would be 7 thou, because that is the smallest gap out of the pair.
now given that the gaps tend to close up not widen. doing a quick check that way ensures none of the clearances are too tight. it's a quick check nothing more.. if they are tight you have to do a full clearance check. the maintenance period for doing the valves is 7k ish. yours has only done 3k so not critical at this point. so provided not of the vales were tight you should be ok for now.

as for the flywheel your not going to turn the engine the wrong way just tighten a bloody nut. it's a left hand thread so how are you going to tighten it without turning it anti clockwise. all you have to do is shock it tight so it doesn't come loose when you turn it clockwise (as in engine rotation) to check if the engine is free without it undoing again. come on man it's not rocket science. just simple engineering.

a clanking noise when the engine turns is NEW information also. suggest at this pinot you take the case off (if it's not off already) you never said either way. remove the centre bolt and pull off the flywheel to check if any of the bolts holding the starter clutch (onto the back of the fly wheel are LOOSE. and trying to destroy the sprocket of the starter chain that lies behind it. there should not be any clanking when the engine is turned over. EVER.

this is also new information I suspected this was the case a 7 year old bike with 3k has to have been stood for a few years. and to get a 2 grand bike for 600 it has to have got issues. and yes it probably was the reason it was cheap.
either way you have it now. and have to fix it. so one thing at a time. suggest you get manual for it and have a good read though it. in the meantime take the case off and the flywheel look for damage. post some photos of what you find.
Thanks sensei the bike was running but only one side it was smokey then I cleaned the carbs but one side was still weak and I tried to synchronize but it was still weak on the left side and when I did check the valves they were super off the right side had no clearance. But it was only making that funky noise when starting sometimes. So I'm gonna pull the fly wheel off. And show u some pics. Thanks again sensei
 

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I never thought about one off those, and I manage a parts store lol. I just went ahead and ordered one. Should be in Friday.
Well greased thread chaser and a small impact (I used a 3/8" air impact) and it pops right off.
 

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@Jackson Lam
You shouldn't be doing anything to the bike with out a service manual. Nothing at all. Nothing "in the mean time" while waiting on a manual. Nothing at all.

@yorkie
You're wrong about the valve clearances. He very well could have had grossly out of spec clearances on a 3k bike. Especially if the initial check was missed. Clearly the PO didn't know what was going on (and also didn't have a manual). May even have been what led to the whole loose flywheel nut fiasco.
Also to suggest checking the valve lash from anywhere other than under the adjustment screw has any validity to it is ridiculous.
 

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I agree about the manual it should be the first thing you buy after obtaining the bike. then read it through Twice to absorb it all. and use as a reference when working on the bike. I have a book case full of them from just about every bike/car I have ever owned.
and while most things can be found in the manual (95% of it) somethings cannot for instance you will not find much if any reference to bolts backing out or exploding magnets and self destructing CCT's on a gen 1. that's what forums are for.
to learn from the experience of others.

as for the other bit (horses for courses) I thought about @bpe when I wrote it. with he'll be along any minute like a terrier with a big bone, :love::cool:. for a unorthodox procedure. make of it what you will. I do whatever works correct or not I'm no guru or genius just an old bloke with 60 years experience of working on bikes nothing more.
I stated the correct way to check and adjust the valves also. (which is in the manual and on the forum) anything else is just individual comment the mechanical reasoning behind it is sound however (up to a point).

perhaps we should just answer all questions with it's in the manual buy one and read it, would make things far easier wouldn't it. boring but not controversial none the less. trouble is then no one would learn anything new or any of the things not written in the manual. you know the other 5% of bike issues the forum is full of treads about.

I will leave it there with one last comment the saying goes "there is more than one way to skin a rabbit" the object of the exercise is to turn a none running bike into one that works. the end result is more important than how you go about it.
 

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Thanks sensei the bike was running but only one side it was smokey then I cleaned the carbs but one side was still weak and I tried to synchronize but it was still weak on the left side and when I did check the valves they were super off the right side had no clearance. But it was only making that funky noise when starting sometimes. So I'm gonna pull the fly wheel off. And show u some pics. Thanks again sensei
Unm
I agree about the manual it should be the first thing you buy after obtaining the bike. then read it through Twice to absorb it all. and use as a reference when working on the bike. I have a book case full of them from just about every bike/car I have ever owned.
and while most things can be found in the manual (95% of it) somethings cannot for instance you will not find much if any reference to bolts backing out or exploding magnets and self destructing CCT's on a gen 1. that's what forums are for.
to learn from the experience of others.

as for the other bit (horses for courses) I thought about @bpe when I wrote it. with he'll be along any minute like a terrier with a big bone, :love::cool:. for a unorthodox procedure. make of it what you will. I do whatever works correct or not I'm no guru or genius just an old bloke with 60 years experience of working on bikes nothing more.
I stated the correct way to check and adjust the valves also. (which is in the manual and on the forum) anything else is just individual comment the mechanical reasoning behind it is sound however (up to a point).

perhaps we should just answer all questions with it's in the manual buy one and read it, would make things far easier wouldn't it. boring but not controversial none the less. trouble is then no one would learn anything new or any of the things not written in the manual. you know the other 5% of bike issues the forum is full of treads about.

I will leave it there with one last comment the saying goes "there is more than one way to skin a rabbit" the object of the exercise is to turn a none running bike into one that works. the end result is more important than how you go about it.
Hello sensei. Im still having seizing problems. I took off the flywheel and everything looks fine. It's when I'm turning the motor to do valve checks it gets caught and the bolt starts coming out. What happens when I turn it counter clockwise to tighten the bolt then clockwise to set the clearances. While I turn it I hear a loud clank the Same clank I would hear when starting the bike. Sometimes and sometimes it started just fine. It sounds like it's coming from piston number 1
 

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Unm

Hello sensei. Im still having seizing problems. I took off the flywheel and everything looks fine. It's when I'm turning the motor to do valve checks it gets caught and the bolt starts coming out. What happens when I turn it counter clockwise to tighten the bolt then clockwise to set the clearances. While I turn it I hear a loud clank the Same clank I would hear when starting the bike. Sometimes and sometimes it started just fine. It sounds like it's coming from piston number 1
 

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can you post some photos of the back of the fly wheel and the starter sprocket on the bike. may help.
also another possibility. when you took the top valve cover off did you account for BOTH the little dowels located in the cover. if one of those went down the timing chain hole it would jam up the engine while turning one way.
 

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Here's what we know for sure. You did not do to valve adjustment correctly. So you will need to redo that. Here's some valve adjustment info:
Valve Adjustment (bpe version)

That manual you have is not one that is for your bike. You need a correct one.

To tighten the flywheel bolt you need to have a flywheel holder or a strap wrench to hold the flywheel while tightening the bolt counter clockwise to 51ft.lbs.


Something else to consider:
You have very little invested in the bike at this point. You may want to just start parting it out to recoup cost, should even be able to make a profit. Especially if the fairings are in decent shape.
 

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yes the manual you have is the wrong one this is mine.
54600


I am sorry @bpe I do not agree (no surprise there) while parting out could well be one option for a bike that is impossible to repair we are no where near that point by a long way.
the only thing radically wrong here is person wielding the spanners. :cool: I am afraid to say.

what we do know is the bikes a gen 2 so no gen 1 maladies. it has only 3k on it so should be repairable. it did run at one time although poorly. it's been stood idle a long time but there is no information on how or why the PO parked it up. something is going on we are not aware of.
I will make a prediction if any of us were stood there beside the bike it would be running well in no time.
one thing for sure a cocked up valve adjustment will not cause the issues the OP has. something has been done while working on it. as yet undiscovered. I wish it was sat in my garage right now it would be running well before the end of the day it needs experienced hands to look at it. the forum members have sorted out far worse bikes than this. but the OP has to work with us and supply the info we require. then then follow to the letter the things we suggest he does.
no more no less.

I would never consider parting out a bike just because it seemed too much hassle to fix it. it's way too hard. (I speak from experience) first you have to strip it and clean the parts. have somewhere to store all the parts. most of them for a considerable time period. hassle of shipping. and in full knowledge you will never sell 100% of the bike may 50% if your very lucky. the rest will end up in a dumpster during a garage clean out in few years time.

a better idea is to off load it on your Craigslist or E- bay spares or repair and hope to get most of your money back.
but that would only be after you had decided you were not able to fix it. were no where near that point right now.
 

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^ Not saying it's not repairable. What the better option is for you is not always the better option for others.
 

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^^ FYI he has a gen 2.
IMO this is already getting complicated a little, just because we're piggy backing off an old thread.
 

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I am not selling or parting before this thing is fixed. If I have to overhaul I i will. I got the correct book. I down loaded the pdf. And in does PO mean project officer? So I stuck a flat blade screwdriver and turned the alternator rotor bolt (flywheel bolt) counter clockwise to tighten. I really need that special flywheel holder or maybe a big oil filter wrench. And I see the other confusion the 1 threads on flywheel rotation are backwords.
 

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PO = Previous Owner
You can not tighten a flywheel bolt with a screwdriver.
 

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^^ FYI he has a gen 2.
IMO this is already getting complicated a little, just because we're piggy backing off an old thread.
what we do know is the bikes a gen 2 so no gen 1 maladies.
yes I'm well aware of what bike it is thanks.
So I stuck a flat blade screwdriver and turned the alternator rotor bolt (flywheel bolt) counter clockwise to tighten. I really need that special flywheel holder or maybe a big oil filter wrench. And I see the other confusion the 1 threads on flywheel rotation are backwords.
if you had done as I suggested earlier. it wouldn't have been so much hassle. I put mine on with a impact driver but I don't suppose you have one of those. the nut cannot unscrew in operation as it threaded the opposite of engine rotation. all you needed was it tight enough to turn the engine over by hand to see if the binding was engine or something after the crank shaft.
 

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I am not selling or parting before this thing is fixed. If I have to overhaul I i will. I got the correct book. I down loaded the pdf. And in does PO mean project officer? So I stuck a flat blade screwdriver and turned the alternator rotor bolt (flywheel bolt) counter clockwise to tighten. I really need that special flywheel holder or maybe a big oil filter wrench. And I see the other confusion the 1 threads on flywheel rotation are backwords.

So I figure out why the valve clearances was so off. It is bent exaust valves.
 

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