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Discussion Starter #1 (Edited)
Hi all!
So I've been working on my project bike a bit recently, been getting it ready to start firing up. Have a strange problem, at least I think it is. My sprag clutch engages when turning over the engine manually, but not on the starter motor. Anyone else had this problem? And is there any possible fix without taking the flywheel off?
Video for reference: received_913971322729718.mp4
I'm also mostly unfamiliar with these so if this is normal for a dead sprag please don't berate me! 馃槀
TIA,
Tom.
 

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will have to think about this one for a bit something seems reversed. your turning the engine backwards while doing it manually the engine rotates clock wise.
 

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Discussion Starter #3
will have to think about this one for a bit something seems reversed. your turning the engine backwards while doing it manually the engine rotates clock wise.
Yeah, I do know that hehe. Even turning it the way it's supposed to turn, it doesn't engage, as I mentioned, I'm not too familiar with these, so was just looking for some advice.
 

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It's not a "Sprag" clutch, but a Centrifugal one, requires a spin in the correct direction for the flyweights to engage .

FOG
 

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well no it wouldn't that's that's how it works once the engine runs the starter clutch freewheels. the starter is supposed to pull the engine round then then it disengages.
 

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Discussion Starter #6
Yeah, I do know that hehe. Even turning it the way it's supposed to turn, it doesn't engage, as I mentioned, I'm not too familiar with these, so was just looking for some advice.
Tell a lie, it does engage turning it clockwise! So am I correct, being under the impression the starter is spinning the wrong way? I've never had to mess with anything like this in the past, so I apologize for the noob questions.
 

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Discussion Starter #7
Just a thought, read in my trusty Haynes manual that there's a second cable that goes to the starter motor, since I pulled out all of the wiring I'm not sure which cable it is and where it goes to. I highly doubt it'll fix my problem, but want to eliminate it. Any insight lads?
 

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Swap both starter wires. Strter motor is spinning backwards.
 

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how the hell have got it wired. where does the battery earth wire go.
Swap both starter wires. Strter motor is spinning backwards.
there is no other wire to swap he has only one on the positive the other one on the left (earth lead) is missing.
 

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Not sure why we call both wires "starter wires" except for the fact that they both attach at the starter.

The starter wire is the right wire on the starter.
It runs from the starter solenoid to the starter, and provides power to turn the starter.

The wire that attaches on the left side of the starter is a ground wire.
It runs from the negative terminal of the battery to the body of the starter.
It also has a connector near the battery that plugs into the wire harness, brown with a stripe, I think.

This topic sounds familiar; didn't someone recently post pictures of the two wires?
 

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yes they did. and that small diameter wire on the earth lead is black and yellow. (all earth/return wires on the bike are black with a yellow trace). apart form the thick battery wire.
 

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Discussion Starter #12 (Edited)
how the hell have got it wired. where does the battery earth wire go.

there is no other wire to swap he has only one on the positive the other one on the left (earth lead) is missing.
I've got everything wired up temporarily as I'm fitting a Motogadget m.unit (probably should've mentioned that earlier). Battery negative is wired to the frame and engine, starter earth's via the engine.
I can't imagine putting the negative cable to the body of the motor itself will make it spin the opposite way, but I'm up for trying anything.
 

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have you done any work on the starter at all. like service it or swap it out for a new one. I took the vid you supplied edited it as loop and slowed it down to 1/4 speed the starter is spinning the wrong way. this has happened before.
 

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Discussion Starter #14
have you done any work on the starter at all. like service it or swap it out for a new one. I took the vid you supplied edited it as loop and slowed it down to 1/4 speed the starter is spinning the wrong way. this has happened before.
I did take it apart to inspect it and see if it was the cause of a previous problem, which it could well have been. Is there a chance I put it back together wrong?
 

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Where does the negative cable on the battery go to?
 

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I did take it apart to inspect it and see if it was the cause of a previous problem, which it could well have been. Is there a chance I put it back together wrong?
yes I think that is your problem. there was a long debate a while ago were someone had this same issue it lead some of us to do experiments to find out why the motor runs in reverse sometimes. using a spare motor I got the motor to run both clockwise and anti clockwise by changing the position of the brushes.

basically what happens is inside the motor are a set of permanent magnets aligned side by side around the core. one being N/S the next one S/N and so on. each of these segments has section on the brass ring where the brushes sit.
so some section are positive while the next one is negative. the motor because of this arrangement always stops in the same place when the power is cut due to the permanent magnet aligning with the section it controls and because one of the brushes suppling power is positive and the other negative.
if the brushes are positioned one segment either way the motor starts and stops in a different rotation, so if it stops on a positive it starts on a positive and visa versa.
starting on a positive drives the motor clockwise starting on a negative drives the motor anti clockwise. I think this is your issue. something is out of line inside the motor.

on the wiring front yes what you have will work I have similar system on the cruiser but it would be better if the high amp cable from the battery went to the area of most high amp drain first near the starter motor (as stock) and then to the frame from a cable to the frame. it is the only component on the bike that uses such high current load.
 

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Discussion Starter #20
yes I think that is your problem. there was a long debate a while ago were someone had this same issue it lead some of us to do experiments to find out why the motor runs in reverse sometimes. using a spare motor I got the motor to run both clockwise and anti clockwise by changing the position of the brushes.

basically what happens is inside the motor are a set of permanent magnets aligned side by side around the core. one being N/S the next one S/N and so on. each of these segments has section on the brass ring where the brushes sit.
so some section are positive while the next one is negative. the motor because of this arrangement always stops in the same place when the power is cut due to the permanent magnet aligning with the section it controls and because one of the brushes suppling power is positive and the other negative.
if the brushes are positioned one segment either way the motor starts and stops in a different rotation, so if it stops on a positive it starts on a positive and visa versa.
starting on a positive drives the motor clockwise starting on a negative drives the motor anti clockwise. I think this is your issue. something is out of line inside the motor.

on the wiring front yes what you have will work I have similar system on the cruiser but it would be better if the high amp cable from the battery went to the area of most high amp drain first near the starter motor (as stock) and then to the frame from a cable to the frame. it is the only component on the bike that uses such high current load.
I have tried a few things this morning. Earth to the body of the starter motor. Direct power from the battery to the motor both same result. Thought maybe, on the off chance, swapping the ground and switched power on the solenoid round in the plug, no change. So it does lead me to believe I have done something wrong putting the starter back together. What could I do differently, to see if it changes?
 
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